Missouri - Home of the Sexually Insecure
The results are in, and it looks like 70% of Missourians fear homosexuals enough to enshrine discimination against them in their Constitution. This is all the more depressing because 100,000+ more Democrats showed up to the polls than Republicans.
Back in June, in response to the inquisitive ThatColoredFella, I posted my prediction, and it was that the amendment would pass 60-40. I thought I was being realistic - I didn't know how bad it would be.
posted by Dan at 8/04/2004 05:44:00 AM
7 Comments:
lj:
"It's difficult to imagine that 70% of the people are driven by such a shallow reason, particularly democrats."
While I admit it's difficult to see so many Democrats forgoing intelligence for emotion, it's not at all surprising to see 70% of the population driven by fear. The Patriot Act is a great example of how people will allow horrible awful things to happen when they are scared. To strike a little closer to the issue, how long ago was it that 70% of the population opposed interracial marriage? How long ago was it that 70% of the population opposed school intergration? In these situtations woudl you say that simply because 70% of the population nfelt that way, that they had good valid reasons to?
"I have never held to the false notion that homosexuals are born predisposed to that lifestyle."
Then you are laughing in the face of modern science and in the face of common sense. First I'll address science. Every major study from a legitimate (non-biased) scientific organization (that's right Focus-on-the-Family doesn't count) done in the last 30 years (prior to that very little research at all had been done on the topic) has shown that while the roots of sexuality are not 100% understood, we DO know that sexuality is considered to be established and unchangable by the age of 3 at the latest. Now for common sense. The choice argument fails to hold up against common sense because I've yet to have anyone tell me when they CHOSE to be heterosexual. So lj, when did you wake up and decide to be straight?
"Of course I believe it to be a choice of lifestyle. One in which should not be forced upon other Americans."
Interesting lj. Perhaps you could explain to me precisely how, in the absence of this legislation, anybody would be "forced" to be gay.
dolphin
http://www.dolphinsdock.com/blog/
LJ:
It's not always fear when people vote opposite of me. In this case, though, it is. You yourself, on your blog, admit that the reason people voted against gay marriage is because they hate the gay "lifestyle".
And, yes, members of the democratic party voted against gay marriage.
lj:
I appreciate your honesty. I will not argue with you on this as I agree we will not come to an agreement. YOu have stated that you believe what you believe and no amount of science, logic, or common sense will change your beliefs. While belief without reason is an odd concept to me, to each his own. I caution you in your claims that in a society where only 3 of the 10 Commandments are law, that our laws are somehow based on your personal religous beliefs or that they ought to be. Fortunately for me, history as a guide one can only assume that gay people will one day have the same rights as straight people as soceity continues to progress and those who used gross misinterpretations of the bible to justify hating gay people will eventually be looked at in the same way as those who used that same book to justify slavery and to prohibit interracial marriage.
Dan,
After reading about the results, I immediately blogged my thoughts (also at WatchBlog.com).
I titled it 'Conservatives' Hollow Victory'. Although, the turnout was bigger than the recent state Primaries, only 40% of 3.58 million voters showed. The around 70% majority came out to about 28% of the electorate - a familiar average of hardcore, rabid Conservatives here in Illinois.
I surmised, that they garnered no significant support outside their followers, and shows the low priority among energized Democrats sure to show, en masse, come November. I also wondered if most feel Gay Marriage inevitable, and/or are assured that the courts will make it right.
Your thoughts?
thatcoloredfella
TCF:
I wish I shared your knack for optimism, but I believe that the 70% represents a broad segment of the voting public, and not just the rabid right. I'm convinced that a lot of democrats are not yet ready to accept gay marriage. I also believe that the hard-core left did come out for these elections - there were a bunch of good democratic races in the primaries.
LJ, where's your blog? I'd like to read more.
ThatColoredFella said, "I'm always reluctant to say out loud, but for this country to be the freest on the globe, there are far to many stupid, ignorant, uneducated hypocrites taking up space. . . . .[European] countries are a melting pot, where different races and cultures have no choice, but to co-exist, confront and respect one another."
We do co-exist, confront and respect each other in this country. Sometimes, the will of the people is different than your will. You are required to be tolerant. Sometimes the will of the people is different than my will and I am required to be tolerant. I am tolerant of your views even though I disagree with many of them. In fact, I usually enjoy reading your comments and the comments of other contributors to this blog.
In liberal circles, "being tolerant" sometimes seems to be code for "people need to agree with the thing my friends or I want to do." Some liberals are very tolerant of "alternative lifestyles" and foreign cultures, but not very tolerant of the conflicting religious or political beliefs of others - particularly the beliefs of conservatives, Christians and Jews. It is ironic, but our country now seems more tolerant of the religious practices and beliefs of religions that are not well established here than it is of religious beliefs and practices that have been commonly held since our country was founded.
What you have to remember when comparing the USA with Europe is that Christianity and Judaism do not have as much influence there. Is Europe tolerant of Christians? Jews? others with conservative moral views? Isn't there a rising tide of anti-Semitism? They don't seem very tolerant of people like me.
We're not all stupid, we're not all ignorant, we're not all hypocrites and disagreeing with you and Dan does not make us so.
RM
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